A $40 Billion TAM Expansion

Since the category of content management was moving slower before, I think a lot of the teams were used to sort of, like, slow paced change. And the thing that’s really been eye opening for everyone, including me, is that there’s one thing to create a new category. There’s another thing to move into this category that’s being driven by AI because the models are changing so fast. This is Revenue Makers, the podcast by Six Cent investigating successful revenue strategies that pushed companies ahead. So, Simon, what could you do with forty billion dollars? Retire. How about that? I could retire and then buy wherever the island that you wanna retire onto. There you go. But we’re gonna be a little more real estate because we’re we have a really great interesting topic today and a great guest. We have Tricia Gelman, who’s the CMO of Box. And many of you out there have probably heard of Box, but not the box that Box has become. And she is gonna talk to us or talk to us about how they’ve expanded their TAM, total adjustable market, by forty billion dollars because of the advent of AI and how they’re weaving into their products. And it’s pretty crazy. And it’s a really fun conversation because AI is touching so much of what marketing is doing and what sales is doing. But here is really transforming their go to market based on how they’re talking about the product, the types of talent they’re hiring, how they’re working with their ecosystem of partners and systems integrators, and and how they’re changing the overall brand of what Box is, right, and and really appealing to a new market. So there’s a ton of area that we covered in this specific episode. Yeah. It’s really kinda it’s massive in terms of all the areas, all the different things that they’re doing, and I think just some really good, you know, there’s not a company out there right now that’s not either rethinking or kind of going through some level of transformation, whether it’s from AI or not. And it’s a really great story just about change and transformation. So let’s let’s dive in. Hey, Trisha. Thanks so much for being on the show today. Listen. We’ve done quite a few episodes on AI and its impact on marketing, on the market, on sales. This kinda takes it into a whole new dimension. Forty billion dollars related to AI. I I just wanna put that into context. Forty billion dollars, and AI has helped you go out and find forty billion dollars of a new market. Can you talk a little bit about that? Yeah. So Box is a really interesting company. When it was founded, it was going into sort of a new area where it was transforming content management by bringing content management to the cloud. So you understand that’s not like the last two years. We’ve been around for a little while. And so initially, we grew really fast because that was a new concept. But then the category of content management is not a hypergrowth category. It’s a category that grows, like, between six and nine percent. And so outside of sort of the initial years of, you know, moving people from on prem to the cloud, the business has pretty much grown in the similar direction. But Aaron Levy, our cofounder, has always been sort of a a big thought leader, and he’s really been involved in the AI space. And he saw that content management as a category really had a ripe opportunity for the use of AI. I mean, ninety percent of most of a company’s data is unstructured. So think about, like, your contracts for sales. Think about your marketing plans for marketing. I mean, like, across every single department and team, there are all of these things. And you can’t really do anything with AI unless you can tap into, you know, this data. I mean, because you can use AI to, like, look at spreadsheets faster, but in the end of the day, like, what are you gonna do with all the data from the spreadsheets? You wanna kinda make it into a contract, an offer letter, an NDA, like, whatever that might be. And so Aaron saw this opportunity and started really building into the AI space. And by building added products, we have the opportunity now to not just create new market, which is around AI, but also to build workflow and automation and things that agents can help us do with this advent of AI. And that puts us into the enterprise content management space, which is still, for the most part, on premise. So there’s a really big opportunity here, not just in a big new TAM, but in us taking market share as well because the people who are in on premise solutions clearly are not taking advantage of AI either. Was there a moment where it was sort of like, okay, like, we’re seeing it, we’re gonna go, or sort of this sort of happened gradually over the last couple years of, like, obviously, generative exploding and kind of everything popping up out of thin air in terms of AI? So I’ve been at Box for six months. And one of the reasons I mean, the main reason I joined, honestly, is because of this opportunity to go after basically an entirely new space. It’s adjacent to our existing space, but it’s new. It requires building a new category. It requires category. It requires aligning sales and marketing in a new way. It requires, like, really thinking differently about, like, how are you building your pipeline, bringing it through the cycle. And these are all the things that I’m passionate about doing, and this kind of opportunity doesn’t come up every single day. But my understanding from our head of sales who kinda recruited me over is that it was an idea that the team had. And so if you think about, like, the traditional offering from Box, we have, like, Box notes in, like, storage and sharing and collaboration, all of which can be helped a lot by AI. I mean, having the opportunity to just, like, go do your prompts within your notes and actually get that information back, etcetera, is really valuable. But then the team saw, like, a couple opportunities for m and a and really saw the opportunity to acquire a smaller company around automation. And when they thought about, like, building automation in and having that native to the platform and then adding the AI on top of it, it just, like, really popped. And honestly, it’s only been, like, a year and a half since that acquisition. And, like, the entire go to market last year, they did the planning for f y twenty five, like, you know, October, November, decided to do the acquisition in December. Basically, we’re like, oh, okay. Wait. I’m a whole new go to market. Yeah. And the world has really changed then for you. Right? If you think about it and I’ve known you for years, Tricia. Aligning sales as mar and marketing has has been something you’ve always been passionate about and talked about, but you’re essentially creating a whole new category at this point for the company. And when you get down to the nuts and bolts of it, there’s a whole lot of collaboration, a whole lot of just changing the focus of existing teams, existing processes, existing planning even to your point. Right? Where do you even start, and then how do you get everyone on board? Yeah. I mean, I think it’s really been an interesting thing because since the category of content management was moving slower before, I think a lot of the teams were used to sort of, like, slow paced change. And the thing that’s really been eye opening for everyone, including me, is that there’s one thing to create a new category. There’s another thing to move into this category that’s being driven by AI. Because the models are changing so fast, and, like, what people are able to do with AI is changing so fast that in order to really build around this category, we’re having to build out that same piece too. And so it’s a myth about, like, how do we get everyone focused on the exact same set of priorities? And, you know, that involves, like, looking at, like, what are the priority industries? What are their priority sales segments? How do we actually look at each segment? Box is also unique because we have a full PLG business that I own all the way up to, like, the largest enterprises in the world. And so we’re having to do this pivot for everyone. And I think you’ve been in companies before that kind of have a SMB business and other businesses. You know, SMBs tend to move a little faster, and the enterprises tend to be a little bit more cautious. And I think we’re seeing this across all of AI. Initially, like, the larger enterprise companies are trying to figure out, like, how do I have my AI, like, internal review board and everything else? So I think it’s great that we have all of these different groups that we can go after because one informs the other. So for example, in our big signature event last year, Box Works, which was in November, we actually finally, like, announced to the market all of this, like, new innovation and what we were planning to do with it. We productized it. We put it into SKUs, etcetera. But we didn’t ship it until January, which is the last month of our fiscal year. And we actually closed, like, an astronomical number of deals in the last two weeks of the year because of the demand for the AI products. But almost all of it, I think three percent of it was in enterprise. All the rest was, like, mid market SMB because they were so excited. And one of the things that’s really exciting and where this additional TAM comes from is that the traditional enterprise content management products that are on premise are really, really expensive. And because of that, they require a lot of professional services. They require long engagements. And mid market and SMB customers have never been able to actually even afford this or put in the time. And so with AI now doing this and making it available, like, you can actually rethink how you run your business, whether you’re, like, a ten person company or a twenty thousand person company. And so that’s really exciting. I think your main question here is, like, how do we actually do this? And what we’ve had to do is change our focus in marketing to be more simple. Think about, like, what are the main messages we’re trying to put out? How do we align through, like, the thought leadership that we’re putting out into the market into sort of that solutions area where we capture from thought leadership down and then bring people through that journey, as well as think about who are the personas. And part of going after a new category and new message is bringing in new personas. That’s a great place for us to dig in actually again. So historically, Box is being sold to was it Mark in marketing as well? Or kind of what were some of the, I guess, the the pre this and then now in terms of personas like work? Because I remember using Box multiple companies years and years, and I was sitting in marketing, but I’m sure that was not a prime was it a primary persona at the time? Or I mean so every company I mean, it’s a wall to wall product. So you put in a storage solution, and the storage solution gets used by everybody. Yeah. And that’s because everybody creates content, and content is kind of a backbone of every business. But the person who makes the decision is typically IT. And it doesn’t mean that others can’t. Like, we have in our PLG motion, like, a lot of people who are just, like, in a department and decide they wanna actually just get boxed for their department. But from a enterprise go to market selling motion, it’s really IT. But a lot of cases in the old category, sort of slow growth category, was, like, an IT person who’s just looking at, like, systems and process and looking a lot of times just to save cost. Like, how do I get rid of my servers? How do we actually move to a cloud solution? I’m moving, like, CapEx, OPEX, etcetera. And, you know, in my mind, it’s actually a lot of, like, set it and forget it. Like, you wanna save the money. You wanna bring in a new solution to, like, improve the security of, like, how you’re storing the content in your company. But once you move it over, which is a few month process, you’re like, oh, everybody’s working in marketing, storing their things here, sales, storing those things there, and you just kinda move on. Whereas now with automation and with AI, you have the opportunity to work with the IT people whose job is really to think of, like, how am I actually operationalizing success for my company? How am I working with the marketing team to think about what the workflows are that we can automate? How am I working with the sales team? How am I working with HR to basically change every single onboarding process for everyone in my company? And there is all of these partnerships that happen between these IT leaders and the business process that they’re empowering versus just looking at, like, what’s the tech stack and the footprint that we have. Is it right that the head of sales is the one who helped recruit you? Yeah. I worked with Mark Whalen at Salesforce. You know, when Drift was purchased by Vista Equity Partners, it was on my daughter’s one year birthday, and I was like, yeah. Okay. This whole world is a little bit too stressful. I’m gonna take a sort of back seat. I’m just gonna do advising and board work. And I kinda thought I would do that until she was in at least kindergarten. Because it was like, after the first year, I’m like, yeah. This is working out. I could do this for a little while. Good thing I stayed in doing that because, you know, with AI and everything else, I don’t know how you step out and then you step back in. But, you know, I was staying current by being involved with a lot of start ups and with the venture companies. So the recruiters, they actually do all the recruiting in house at Box. And the recruiters reached out to me, and I thought to myself, well, I don’t have any idea who this person is, so this cannot be an interesting opportunity. And I just, like, deleted it, honestly. And then the current CMO at the time, Chris Koehler, he was actually one of my champions when Box was using Drift. And so I knew him, and he reached out and he’s like, hey. It’s really amicable over here, but I’m gonna go after this other opportunity. And so I I really think you should talk to Aaron. I think you would be a great CMO. And I was like, okay. Well, if Chris wants me to talk to Aaron, I guess, like, Aaron’s pretty cool. I could talk to him. And then I was still very reticent though. And then Mark Whelan reached out and he’s like, look. Like, this is the opportunity. And he started to lay out, like, this new TAM, the opportunity to transform, to build a category, like, all the really fun stuff as a CMO. And I’m like, okay. I would be a really big jerk if after Chris and Mark reaching out, I basically said, like, nope. See you. I’m not interested in this opportunity. And so then I talked to Olivia who is the COO. And all of sort of go to market basically rolls up to her. And she is a very, very seasoned go to market expert having done, like, consulting for thirteen years in go to market. And I’m like, after I talked to her, I was just so invigorated. And then I would talk to Erin, and I’m like, you know what? This would be fun. Like, a lot of work, but fun. And so I decided I would actually take on the opportunity if they gave it to me, which, you know, Harriet. Which they did. Yeah. And there you go. No. But and I love that because, again, you mentioned some of the things you’re having to do on the marketing side to just shift the way you’re going to market with the personas, with the messaging. But this is an entire go to market transformation now. Right? You’re moving upmarket. You are changing you’re selling change in some way to these especially enterprise companies. And so how has the sales team had to adjust? How has the CS team had to adjust? Like, this is just so broad in its impact. Yeah. I think, you know, we talked a little bit about the personas. And so I think one of the things is that we’ve had to partner really closely with sales and CS because we need to make sure that our existing customers are engaged and they’re happy. And so that is, like, a really you know, a lot of work, as you know, from any company to make sure that your customers are engaged. And so we’ve also been thinking differently about, like, how do we do one to many CS and making sure that we touch people more often. And marketing and CS are working together on, like, really mapping out that onboarding flow and what’s happening, like, post sales. Make sure that everybody who has purchased something is engaged. But the fact of the matter is we’re not gonna get this out of TAM by just talking to the people we already spoke to. So we really have to turn every customer not just into an active user, but a champion so that we can actually go broader within the organization and span across the different parts of IT and move up to the CIO so that the CIO understands, like, what is the true differentiated initiative here. And so that requires marketing, CS, and then sales as well. And so we really have had to move from somewhat transactional process where people are like, oh, I wanna save money. Okay. I’m gonna do a deal. Okay. We’re gonna implement. To, like, what is the true business value that’s happening across the organization. And that has required us to, like, build an entirely new corporate narrative to think about, like, what are the use cases, what is the value within that, really partner with, like, business value selling to identify in our existing customers. Like, what is the true value so that we can retell that story and use that, like, new umbrella to then go deeper within the organization and, like, bring people through that funnel. Talking about the new narrative. And you Box has got strong brand recognition. I mean, we’ve been around for a while. I mean, a lot of comp I’m assuming, like, this is a name that’s permeated throughout for a long time. Have you found that it’s been easier or more difficult 6AI it sort of go back? Even custom people that are not customers say, like, hey. It’s like, you’re sort of the new box. This is not this is not the box you knew from a while ago. I think initially, everybody thought, oh, like, people know us enough that if we just start talking about AI, Aaron has four million followers in Twitter. You know, we’ll get this message out. It’ll be great. But, like, we still you know, Aaron tells these stories about how, you know, he starts talking to the person who’s, like, driving AI and building agents and everything else and some of our best early adopter customers. And then he has a conversation with them and they’re talking about how, oh, like, they have a buddy in x y z company and they’re talking to them, showing them, like, the use case, which, you know, is the best because you wanna, like, spread word-of-mouth in order to make this work. But the other person is like, oh, I had no idea that Box did that. And it turns out they’re a customer. And so really, like, really, really demonstrates the fact that that person who is an AI developer in a custom area of ours never cared about storage in the cloud. As, you know, an AI developer or, like, technical IT developer who’s now become an AI developer, these people were not involved in implementing Box before. So, really, it’s about, like, helping people see us differently and then using that umbrella of, like, why does this matter? What are we doing to get to these new people? It’s a fascinating shift. And just even based on what you just said, finding those users, honing in on the use cases that they are developing, the agents that they’re developing under this new product, that’s where you’re really trying to capture. What are some of the most interesting use cases or agents that you found have been built by customers? Yeah. So the whole, agent building component is, like, a little bit newer. But, you know, one of the, like, first use cases that we saw, like, it is actually there they’ve been in HR. And I guess it’s because there’s, like, a lot of, like, private information like your PII, which Box is known for, like, its differentiation around security. Not that we’re a security product, but just, like, the security that we can bring to a company to secure their data. And so a lot of HR organizations use Box to, you know, keep track of, like, everything about their employees, about all of their onboarding process, about their recruiting, etcetera, because of that, like, security of information. And so one of the first things that we saw was people setting up agents for recruiting. So, you know, people always talk about how recruiting is tough and time consuming. And one of the biggest reasons is because you get in all of these resumes. They’re all different. The structure, the format, like, you know, the information is totally different. And you have to have, like, a little mini army to just, like, feed through all of these resumes. But now what we’ve seen is people building agents where there’s a folder, people submit their resumes online into a company, and the agent basically just goes through and knows what are the keywords you’re looking for, for which roles in the company, and can just parse the resumes into, like, these are the good ones, these are the bad ones, let’s give them a score. And then based on the score and the roles, dump them into other folders so that the recruiters really just have to look at those folders and never have to go through the big folder, which is really cool because it’s increasing the quality of people that are being hired and, like, their time to hire. But then the next phase after that is onboarding, where you have these onboarding flows and really being able to use AI to, like, parse out, like, what is it that you need each of these people to do? And then how do you actually, like, measure them through and help walk them through the onboarding? We had a couple episodes about Adjutants, and it feels like that’s sort of this like, we’re at, like, step two of a thousand in terms of just the whole agentic world. We started shipping AI product in the middle of January. And here we are, like, just a few months later, and everything’s moving so fast. And one of the things that’s super cool about, like, Aaron’s vision around this and his understanding is that he made the decision that we are not a model company, and we’re not gonna try and create our own models or do anything in that way. And so we have, like, a model agnostic platform to the point that if somebody wants to bring their own model, they can bring their own model. And so we’ve been really partnering with all the different model providers to, like, be right there as a partner when they release their models. And that involves also sort of all of this work that’s kind of coming together around, like, the sort of, like, centralized layer for agents to talk to each other. And so there’s a lot of really cool stuff coming down the pipe right now where we’ll end up being one of the first companies to do, like, agent to agent conversations between companies. So, like, we’re working, for example, with Salesforce and Agent Force on their ability for Agent Force to talk to Box AI agents. And, we’re starting to do beta testing of that right now. And one of the, like, main use cases for that is for sales. So in Salesforce, you’ll store, like, all of the information about, like, the size of a deal, all of that stuff, but the actual contract is not stored in Salesforce. And so what we’re able to do now with agents is we can say, like, oh, bring me up x y z, like, deals. Let me know, like, when are the renewal terms for all of these, and then what is it that we wanna offer for the price and now just create new contracts for me. And so that’s pretty cool where you actually have, like, the two agents working together for a sales rep, and you can think of, like, the productivity of it. One, they’re uncovering customers, like, before the renewal cycle so that they can actually get in front of them with new pricing, new offers, and then they can instantly just, like, generate the contract and send it off. One thing I wanna go back to for a second because you talked a little about it is, like, having this base of customers who didn’t realize now that you’re doing all these things. What have you found that’s been the most effective way to sort of, I guess, say reintroduce Box or sort of just reintroduce, like, this is an entirely new paradigm. It’s entirely new products to get the attention of maybe even customers that are have have have worked with Box in the past could still be using. But, again, like, it’s enterprise content storage. It’s kinda off to the corner. Like, what is what’s working easy to be like, oh, wow. That’s really kinda, like, bringing it back to the forefront. I think there’s two things, actually, and I wouldn’t say it’s, like, one or the other. The first is that, you know, you said that we have, like, pretty good brand awareness, which is true in our category. When we actually go to people and say, 6AI, we have something new to say, it’s almost like they tune out. They’re like, no. No. No. Like, in my mind, you’re in this, like, little space. And so I’m not listening to you or, like, there’s, like, some, like, validity of what you’re saying that just, like, doesn’t compute to me. And so what we found is actually, like, going and doing, marketing with partners or system integrators is actually, like, really smart. So, you know, Mark Whalen, who we talked about as our head of sales, he told me this story. He said, you know, it’s really funny. We had all these customers. We’re trying to tell them, like, all these amazing things, and you could see them. They’re just, like, putting our comments into, like, some other box in their head. And then we were in the event with IDC where, you know, they’ve categorized us as a leader. They, like, renamed their market scape around intelligent, which is, like, a huge within the first year, like, picking up the name of our category, essentially. And they start talking about what’s happening in the world and what’s changing and how agents are gonna impact the content management space and, like, why this is related to, like, their market scape. And they said and, you know, one of the leaders in this is Box. And you could see, like, everyone in the room all of a sudden was like, oh, yeah. Box. Oh, yeah. We like Box. And we had just been talking for fifteen minutes, but then they start talking. And now all of a sudden, everyone’s listening. Everyone’s, like, saying, oh, I should hear what Vox has to say. And then IDC is basically telling them, like, oh, blah blah blah blah blah, like, our top messaging and, you know, why this all matters. And they’re like, oh, we need to have meetings. The other thing is, like, in person events. Because when people see it, all of a sudden they’re like, oh, crap. Like, we’ve been talking about agents, but, actually, it’s real. It’s not like a fabricated demo. It’s literally, like, let me show you how this works right now. And then people really get motivated to go back to their companies and really think, like, how do I start to think about this, you know, in our own life cycles and our ability to, like, execute AI today. Kind of remarkable how quickly things are moving. And on that note, talk about your team. Have you had to even just rethink the roles or rethink the specific skills that you’re hiring for or that you’re you’re placing more importance on within a team in order to then bring about a change like this? Yeah. So one of the things we haven’t talked about is the role of the developers. And, like, historically, we did not do marketing to developers. And even when we first started talking about, like, making our product more API driven and, like, opening it up so that people could do more with the agents and things, We kinda thought, okay. Well, we’re also building on a more robust partner framework because when you move from sort of, like, a point solution to workflow, you’re touching across more of the organization. You have to build more things out. There’s a lot more revenue on the table for professional services and for, like, GSIs and partners. In partnership, that’s another thing that we’re building out. And we thought, oh, like, the people who are gonna use these APIs are gonna be the partners. But what we found is that the people who are really passionate about AI and are the ones, like, tinkering and finding the use cases and building out the agents are developers. And so there’s this weird thing where we’ve had to, like, spin up an entire group of people who are putting out videos, like, three to five times a week with, like, tweets and blog posts and everything else of just, like, this massive amount of content educating people on how they can use our APIs and how they can use AI to actually, like, you know, solve their business problems, not just, you know, randomly do development. And that was totally new. And, like, we have an entire platform product marketing group now. And within that, we’re hiring people who have technical AI experience. So not just, like, how do I take the messages of what the products from Box do and, like, write them really nicely and, like, help show the use case, but actually, like, build examples and build content related to, like, how this is actually working. And I think that that’s been really interesting. The other thing is, like, back to, like, building the category and getting in front of people. In today’s day and age, you don’t really have a lot of media to help you tell that story to create that overall awareness. I mean, most of journalists from ten years ago are not journalists anymore. They’re, like, working in our teams, like, actually writing for companies and doing content management and other things. And so, my head of comms, Kate, she was really early on to say, you know, we need to take advantage of building the category through this awareness, but it’s not gonna be because we’re gonna get, like, more stories from New York Times or Wall Street Journal. It’s gonna be because we’re gonna have our leaders in podcasts. We’re gonna have our leaders influencing content that’s showing up in newsletters and really partnering with these main influencers out in the market. And so we’ve been hiring up a team of people to actually do that. We first looked at doing it through agencies, but what we found is our content’s kind of technical, and there aren’t a lot of agencies that actually have this technical expertise. And so it’s probably better for us to just do this directly. And we’re looking all the time on, like, what new podcast 6AI spun up? What new newsletters are out there? Like, who are the top leaders that are talking about AI, and, like, how do we try to get in front of them to get aligned to their message, to sponsor what they’re doing, and or to, like, be a part of the podcast. I mean, that’s a major shift for, I mean, like, any marketing team. Right? Just suddenly, like, you’re like, oh, we’re gonna go. We have an API, and then, like, someone’s gotta go and build the example, the implementation of it, and then share it out there. Right? So, like, that’s Yeah. And I think I mean, I don’t know that all companies have developer relations team. Like, a lot of the companies I’ve worked at did have a developer relations team, but marketing didn’t really work that closely with them because they were, like, so hands on technical. What we’re finding now is that this new person who’s leading our platform product marketing team is actually partnering day to day with the developer relations team. And we’re really working with the product leader who owns that team to say, okay. Like, what are you doing? What are we leader who owns that team to say, okay. Like, what are you doing? What are we doing? How do we actually create this new content motion in order to, like, really be out there and sort of, like, take advantage? We’re also I’m fortunate to have a video team. We’re We’re looking at, like, how do we rebuild our entire YouTube channel so that we can get this content out. And previously, we had a box set of channels and a developer relations set of channels. And right now, like, even just last week, we decided we’re gonna compress them. And it’s, like, it’s all, like, the same group of people. And so that’s why we have to, like, really think about how do we rebuild the YouTube channel so it actually has, like, sub areas within it. And it’s very clear, and people can, like, find what it is that they want and need right away. It’s really, a crazy time here at Vox, I would say. And it’s interesting to see, like, the people in the team that are, like, embracing the change and moving forward. And then some of the people that are, like, kinda wondering, like, what do I do? My goal as a CMO is to kind of inspire everybody to step up and to embrace this. And it’s very challenging. But at the same time, I think the thing that’s really challenging for us right now is, like, it’s all new. And so it feels very thrashy. And what I try to get the team to understand is when you do something new, especially when you’ve been doing a lot of the same things for, like, over five years, it’s gonna feel thrashy because, like I said, the product marketing team is working in new ways with developer relations. The marketing team is, like, working differently with the sales team. Like, everybody’s working with different people, different processes, different challenges, but, you know, with very clear goals. And so for probably three to four months, it’s all gonna feel thrashy until what we’re doing becomes, like, the new normal. Totally. I mean, it’s it’s it’s exciting to watch, and and it’s exciting to hear, you know, all the things that you’re doing. Trisha, we have a question that we ask everyone who joins the podcast. We like to end on it. What is the most ridiculous thing you’ve been asked to do in your career? When I was at Salesforce, it seemed kind of ridiculous. And in today’s day and age, it would actually seem like even more scary. But, you know, when we were trying to establish the fact that the cloud was a thing, we would go to, like, Oracle’s main conference, and we would pick it. And you’re like, no. No. No. I didn’t show up at work today to, like, grab a stick and, like, go pick it on the street. But, I mean, that’s what we did to create noise and to create media attention. And it worked. Like, it totally worked because we were basically, like, oh, Larry Ellison’s in there, and he’s gonna, like, have some blah blah message. But what we want is for the media to cover us. And so, like, we totally created this distraction that I mean, we were really small then. We were less than a billion dollar company, and we got coverage out of it. We could talk all day on this topic, I think, because we’ve gone pretty far, but this was great. Appreciate you jumping on talking about it. I think I I’m gonna go do a bunch of deep dive into Box now because I’m really interested in what you guys are doing, and I think it’s really, it’s a great lesson to anybody, any market go to market team out there that, like, change is good, change is scary, change happen fast, but it can create a massive amount of opportunity, which you’ve clearly really shown. Yeah. And I think I mean, the thing that I’m trying to, like you know, it’s just not my normal. Like, I’m always, like, building and growing teams and, you know, I’m pivoting a little bit, but I think this is, like, a real massive year of change, and it’s uncomfortable. And being okay with uncomfortable is, like, a new normal that you have to embrace. But then, like, also celebrate. And that’s what I’m trying to do with the team too is, like, celebrate each of the things that are, like, wins that we’ve achieved. And it’s not gonna all just be different and great, like, you know, the next day. But oh, okay. So and so launched a new model. And on the day they launched it, we had a webinar. We had, you know, our little education videos. We had all of this content and things, like, on that day. I mean, even when I joined six months ago, we were in no 6AI, shape, or form set up to do something like that. And the fact that we’re doing it, like, sometimes twice a week with different model providers right now, it’s just awesome. It’s awesome to see how the teams come together and how we’re, like, really just doing new things. It was fun. Thanks so much, Tricia. Thanks for having me. You’ve been listening to Revenue Makers. Do you have a revenue project you were asked to execute that had wild success? Share your story with us at six cents dot com slash revenue, and we might just ask you to come on the show. And if you don’t wanna miss the next episode, be sure to follow along on your favorite podcast app.